Regen 0.972 and 0.972D

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Shadow
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Post by Shadow » Sat Nov 21, 2009 12:22 pm

King of Chaos

I complete impossible job, just one guy give me Mega Drive to repair, i fix his console and just in time, i connect console to my Behold TV tuner and make record! sorry for big size of file, but you can download here:

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=282Q5C52
Last edited by Shadow on Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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King Of Chaos
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Post by King Of Chaos » Sat Nov 21, 2009 5:33 pm

It... sounds... odd. What kind of TV exactly are you hooking that thing up to?

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Post by Shadow » Sat Nov 21, 2009 6:19 pm

This from Behold TV tuner Philips SAA7391, i make sound record in this program, no its real sound like in JVC, but yes sound a bit strange, he must play slower at 5%, but it no important thing, i try to show real volume levels from real thing which work in Mono and 22050Hz and have loud PSG, believe me this is own Mega Drive 2 sounds :wink:

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Post by King Of Chaos » Sat Nov 21, 2009 6:48 pm

Yeah, hat just sounds so wrong to my ears. You should see/hear my model 1 Genesis (without TMSS) hooked up to my 60 inch LCD HDTV. :P

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Post by Shadow » Sat Nov 21, 2009 7:07 pm

but in 1993 year LCD no created yet, just old CRT TV set's like a JVC, my main task return old style of sound in Regen and Kega, this is important for all people with old TV set's and another things :wink:

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Post by Flygon » Sat Nov 21, 2009 11:05 pm

Ever consider that older TVs could have been giving a less faithful recreation of the sound?

80's/90's CRT TV's aren't exactly well known for high quality speakers. :P

Then again, I wouldn't say LCD TV's fare much better either, they always sound so muffed...

It's hard to satisfy everyone, even if you are right, you're wrong. :)

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Post by TmEE co.(TM) » Sun Nov 22, 2009 1:42 am

If you want good sound that you can compare with something, you use a HiFi... typical TV gives you some 100Hz to 12000Hz freq response on the lame speakers they have in them
Mida sa loed ? Nagunii aru ei saa ;)
http://www.tmeeco.eu
Files of all broken links and images of mine are found here : http://www.tmeeco.eu/FileDen

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Post by Shadow » Sun Nov 22, 2009 7:50 am

I never think about future, i always think about Past, in Russia not possible buy LCD TV in 1990! we even don't know about stereo at all! i hate remix modifications, i want original which was created in Japan, my first console was made in japan, and it my best console than ever, i don't like any improvements, bass boosting and stereo delay, and very silent PSG, i need only one thing option or advanced setups for emulation own sound standard, i don't say broke all your favorite sound system, i just want more advanced adjusters, for example switch to Mono :wink:

I don't know if you say what all correct, why i don't hear explosions, blow wind, effect after spin dash and all cool PSG sfx? this is just sound ghost's?
i don't believe any words, this is not my sound system at all :wink:

You even count own Real Mega Drive AFAIK? which originally was made in Japan! sorry guys but i close theme, because it useless for you all, but important for me and all russian people :)

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Post by sheath » Sun Nov 22, 2009 1:19 pm

Shadow, I agree with your logic. That you want to be able to hear the games the way you did on real hardware (which includes the way they looked and sounded on TVs and speakers available at the time). It seems like most of the folks here tend to hard modify their hardware to get as close to the pure chip output as possible, and this is how the emulators were designed as well.

I personally shut a game off in emulation if I notice a sound missing, or if the audio peaks at frequencies I don't hear from real hardware. I've had my Genesis hooked up through the headphone jack to at least a stereo boom box with detachable speakers since day one. I upgraded to a Yamaha Dolby Prologic tuner in 1993, with the sound coming out the Sega CD 1 and never looked back.

With that said, I would only expect an emulator running on a machine hooked up to the same sound system and, in my case 40" RPTV, to look and sound the same as my Genesis 1 Sega CD 1 does.

If anybody is interested, I am willing to run a series of audio comparisons on any games that show up as "In Library" at www.gamepilgrimage.com with any variety of hardware that I have on site and whatever emulator build you want. View the Golden Axe Audio comparison for an example of my comparison format.

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Post by Shadow » Sun Nov 22, 2009 6:01 pm

Well... but one thing which make me mad - delete original things, i read very old readme first emulator Genecyst for MS-DOS, and i read next: use Stereo, Mono sucks! and alright they say it but it not matter for me, next after Gens 2.12 all another emulators not have Mono output! just deleted for reason "sucks" i not write these words if all functions will be always available, if in some country'es people hate some features, but on this planet someone need it, so i need it! i don't want hear sound from another regions! not matter; blurry, Mono, weird PSG volumes, just this is my good past! for example: i hate modern games, new Wide LCD Screens 16:9, and all another things, but i don't do revenge, and not tell destroy these "sucks" modern devices, i friendly man and try to save all good things which we have in lovely 1990 years, yeah you all use modern TV set's very good, but don't kill some features which i really love - Mono output, please return this cool feature :wink:

Your best friend Shadow :)

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Post by sheath » Sun Nov 22, 2009 6:27 pm

Some of my favorite 1st gen Genesis games only output in mono. I'd also have to say that I think the samples you posted sound better than emulation in the sense that *all* of the instruments and effects are are crystal clear. They don't in any way sound like original hardware to me though, as I'm used to what I described.

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Post by King Of Chaos » Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:21 pm

Yeah, but it's near impossible to completely match the output of the sound from certain TVs and besides, the accuracy focused emulators emulate the Genesis/Mega Drive hardware itself and not the TVs that output the sound (or at least, they should!). Now, that doesn't mean that the authors can't add "TV Sound Mode" options that allows one to modify settings to get close to the TVs but I don't see the point - and if it's added, allow it to be disabled or for it to be optional. I'm personally happy as is now.

Kega Fusion outputs sound that sounds exactly like my TV that outputs sound for my model 1 Genesis. Regen does come pretty close here but it seems to be too loud in certain areas on certain instruments (check Separation Anxiety for this!). Genesis Plus GX for the Nintendo Wii sounds like my model 1 too, so that works good for me. :)

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Post by sheath » Mon Nov 23, 2009 12:28 am

I can definitely appreciate not trying to emulate the actual output of a television. I would prefer the emulation, or at least the filters, be focused on the actual output of the consoles. That is, I am opposed to the idea of focusing emulation on a theoretical "perfect" output that would require modifications to the original hardware. Beggars can't be choosers obviously, but I can certainly contest that any emulator looks or sounds exactly like the actual output from my Genesis 1, or through the Sega CD audio out.

I have my emulation box hooked up to the same television and sound system as my Genesis 1 Sega CD combo and I can definitely tell the difference in the audio and video. Take MUSHA or Golden Axe with these emulators and all of the high pitches become ear splitting at points via emulation. Worse than this though is missing sound effects or muddled instruments via emulation. Reading these forums I have discovered that Genesis 2 actually sounds very close to some of the best examples I could list. So I realize the problem is very complex.

It has also been a little over a year since I have done a technical comparison, but I have kept up with the latest versions of Gens, Kega Fusion and now Regen. Regen is the only one that has yet to blow me out of a game with overly sharp AV on my RPTV/Surround Sound setup.

Perhaps if I plugged the computer into an SDTV I would feel differently.

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Post by Shadow » Mon Nov 23, 2009 4:19 am

For me better setups: Overdrive aspect: 1.89, PSG 1.45, lowpass filter, Overdrive

And it good only for me
Last edited by Shadow on Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Shadow » Mon Nov 23, 2009 9:57 am

I found new bugs

When enable lowpass filter and Overdrive and Super HQ, it can cause distortions in Sonic 3 - Ice Cap level, sfx of rings distorted.

Mortal Kombat 3 i don't know but in Kega 3.63 it work fine, in Regen with autodetect region it sometimes show message: not compatible region, this game work if manually switch to USA, in Regen 0.96 this no happen! i think you may check it, just switch to JAP and return to autodetect and now run Mortal Kombat 3 and you see this message, this is easy way to detect error.
Last edited by Shadow on Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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